tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post550419838670959555..comments2024-03-27T12:53:39.298+01:00Comments on A view from the cycle path: Shared Use Paths create conflict and cause complaints about "speed"David Hembrowhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14543024940730663645noreply@blogger.comBlogger22125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-24876150733263121132016-11-02T11:26:19.079+01:002016-11-02T11:26:19.079+01:00Roger: Thank-you very much for your response. I...Roger: Thank-you very much for your response. I'm afraid the "pointing the finger" part of my blog post is not something you can attribute to me. It's a quote from Malcolm Shephard, then Sustrans' chief executive. He made this comment to the press at the time when Sustrans and CTC were announcing joint support for the Sustrans "code of conduct". I linked to my David Hembrowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14543024940730663645noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-8695122134385322972016-11-02T00:06:03.023+01:002016-11-02T00:06:03.023+01:00David
I have only just come across this article. ...David<br /><br />I have only just come across this article. It has much that Cycling UK would strongly agree with - as is usually the case with your often excellent blogs.<br /><br />However, from time to time, you are prone to attribute views to Cycling UK that we do not hold. This article contains an example.<br /><br />You suggest that Cycling UK (which was then named CTC) was part of a jointRoger Geffen, Policy Director, Cycling UKhttp://www.cyclinguk.org/campaignsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-37848950548728549292016-08-02T11:06:44.394+02:002016-08-02T11:06:44.394+02:00I've only been cycling 6 months but I am comfo...I've only been cycling 6 months but I am comfortable on the road and quite competent and visible. I don't like seeing cyclists on the path when it is not necessary, but i understand the fears some have of the road . I always assume Audi drivers are going to do something stupid, I tried hard not to do this initially thinking I was being somewhat discriminant, but it can't be helped.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-63998324298622263312016-07-04T12:18:04.938+02:002016-07-04T12:18:04.938+02:00Bird: I think you've misunderstood the emphasi...Bird: I think you've misunderstood the emphasis and meaning of my article.<br /><br />Shared Use paths are bad not simply because they are inconvenient and result in danger for both cyclists and pedestrians, but because that inconvenience and danger results in fewer people cycling and more people using motor vehicles.<br /><br />Drivers in cars do not expect their journeys to be made at David Hembrowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14543024940730663645noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-42177321568226448042016-07-04T11:52:32.247+02:002016-07-04T11:52:32.247+02:00Hmm. It seems to me that the argument that I'...Hmm. It seems to me that the argument that I'm hearing here is almost identical to the one often put forward by some motorists that cyclist "get in the way / are a nuisance / slow my journey down". In society, there is always a need for consideration and compromise, a lack of which is evident just about everywhere you care to look. <br /><br />I ride a bike regularly. I choose Birdhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13230369925763134398noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-68414212591985427582015-10-12T12:57:49.584+02:002015-10-12T12:57:49.584+02:00Cycle-paths in the countryside on which you have t...Cycle-paths in the countryside on which you have to walk because there is no separate provision for pedestrians are called cycle-paths. This is exactly analogous to how roads in parts of the countryside where there is neither a cycle-path or a pedestrian path are called roads. I explained this <a href="http://www.aviewfromthecyclepath.com/2014/04/is-that-shared-use-path-do-dutch-cycle.html" rel="David Hembrowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14543024940730663645noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-42988321268719754462015-10-10T16:18:33.571+02:002015-10-10T16:18:33.571+02:00What do the Dutch call the pathways in rural and e...What do the Dutch call the pathways in rural and exurb areas where pedestrian volumes are very low and the pedestrians walk where the bicycles do, and if there is a bicycle path next to the road, designed of course like a bikeway, continuity at junctions, priority over minor side roads, smooth, wide, subject to bicycle signals not pedestrian green mans, what is that called to a Dutch eye? Shared Multiparty Democracy Todayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13359081992141220593noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-67060166151073231042015-10-10T08:09:10.509+02:002015-10-10T08:09:10.509+02:00It is a criminal offence in England to recklessly ...It is a criminal offence in England to recklessly or intentionally interferes with the safety of a person. Does this mean that we could make a citizens arrest on the DfT and TFL bosses who tell their engineers not to add cycle infrastructure because the excuses they make don't add up, cost, road width, congestion causing, confusing, etc, and because they haven't cared enough about the Multiparty Democracy Todayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13359081992141220593noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-62740287959230160262015-10-04T07:11:58.385+02:002015-10-04T07:11:58.385+02:00Same rubbish about 'dangerous' cycling on ...Same rubbish about 'dangerous' cycling on shared use paths in Australia:<br /><br />http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/western-australia/three-in-five-perth-cyclists-clocked-above-20kmh-on-shared-paths/story-fnhocxo3-1227554632462<br /><br />http://www.news.com.au/national/south-australia/holdfast-council-wants-police-to-book-cyclists-who-exceed-10kmh-along-adelaides-coast-park/Architectonichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00768214042986413291noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-11219270331330887572015-02-09T10:23:27.470+01:002015-02-09T10:23:27.470+01:00Paul, there is little if any published research on...Paul, there is little if any published research on this. However, policy in the Netherlands now is nowhere near so friendly towards bicycles <a href="http://www.aviewfromthecyclepath.com/search/label/assen_mistakes" rel="nofollow">as it was 10-15 years ago</a>. I think the Netherlands has peaked. Sadly, the country has started to substitute marketing and BS for actual engineering where cycling isDavid Hembrowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14543024940730663645noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-57453436299143750912015-02-09T01:05:37.907+01:002015-02-09T01:05:37.907+01:00hi there,
Thank you very much for your blog - it&...hi there,<br /><br />Thank you very much for your blog - it's very impressive! I was wondering if you could help me - I'm trying to understand whether cycling's modal share has plateaued (sp?) in NL or if it's continuing to increase. Are there any english-language sources that cover this? I've had a scan through some of the sources you link to, but couldn't track it down.<Paulhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06409125505469212098noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-92116554763049782772014-12-05T18:31:20.008+01:002014-12-05T18:31:20.008+01:00David, thank you for your kind words.
My experienc...David, thank you for your kind words.<br />My experience of cycling in Vondelpark is that most pedestrians and cyclists comfortably share the tarmac paths for getting around. If the pedestrians are meant to only use the gravel paths they happily ignore that advice much of the time.<br />I think my views on Hyde Park are closer to yours than you imagine. The current system doesn't work, I am charlie_lcchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03847189408357769893noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-13875031016712482312014-12-02T15:23:03.089+01:002014-12-02T15:23:03.089+01:00Charlie: If you think there's no separate prov...Charlie: If you think there's no separate provision for pedestrians in Vondelpark you really should go and take a closer look. Paths there are wide and suitable for far higher speeds than 5 mph by bicycle.<br /><br />The problem in Hyde Park is inadequate provision for everyone. Cyclists and pedestrians alike are squashed onto a path which is far too narrow and has "segregation" by David Hembrowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14543024940730663645noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-55876653269414153482014-12-02T14:21:47.109+01:002014-12-02T14:21:47.109+01:00Hi, the path through Hyde Park where Jeremy Vine ...Hi, the path through Hyde Park where Jeremy Vine was stopped by police is a segregated cycle path. It is very crowded and peak hour flows are well over 1000 cyclists an hour. Campaign groups have lobbied for cycling to be allowed on more paths and for safe junctions allowing easier access to the roads where cyclists can easily cycle as fast as they like.<br /><br />The segregated path causes charlie_lcchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03847189408357769893noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-72090839671849223442014-11-24T19:23:26.798+01:002014-11-24T19:23:26.798+01:00David: The huge corner radii are th most obviously...David: The huge corner radii are th most obviously bad detail. Cars and bikes don't cross at anything like 90° and this will make it difficult for drivers to see cyclists at the same time as encouraging them to keep up an overly high speed though the corner.<br /><br />1.5 metres is far too narrow. I can't think of any cycle-path near here which is so narrow, even relics from the 1980s David Hembrowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14543024940730663645noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-73291086393522013672014-11-24T19:18:02.807+01:002014-11-24T19:18:02.807+01:00SFB: Sorry I overlooked your question. I don't...SFB: Sorry I overlooked your question. I don't think there is any good reason to consider 'shred space'. The safety record of these places <a href="http://www.aviewfromthecyclepath.com/2014/04/where-crashes-are-shared-space-and.html" rel="nofollow">is atrocious</a> and they <a href="http://www.aviewfromthecyclepath.com/2014/04/shared-space-revisited-hype-continues.html" rel="nofollow"David Hembrowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14543024940730663645noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-58642212538645364542014-11-24T19:12:35.088+01:002014-11-24T19:12:35.088+01:00I'd suggest sending all the shared space advoc...I'd suggest sending all the shared space advocates to visit a "shared space zoo" where there are no cages and everything's running about free, let's see how well that works. <br />There's a reason why they don't put mice in the same enclosure as big snakes and it's the same reason why cycling on the road is horrible and why shared use paths should be forgotten. Terryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00953000649232076966noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-23697168302698231012014-11-24T19:03:07.817+01:002014-11-24T19:03:07.817+01:00The setback varies a bit depending on which side o...The setback varies a bit depending on which side of the street has the onstreet parking. We don't have parking "bays" like in the Netherlands due to snow clearing considerations so some of what you're seeing is actually onstreet parking - indeed snow clearing considerations (and fire truck design) result in a lot of street design features being passed over and the imposition of Davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15857050473904460243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-33585920436170405662014-11-24T17:39:02.144+01:002014-11-24T17:39:02.144+01:00Hi David, thanks for sending that link. I also hav...Hi David, thanks for sending that link. I also have doubts about how "Dutch" it is. The side-road crossing design has all the same faults as a similarly flawed one which I saw in Norway and I expect it will have <a href="http://www.aviewfromthecyclepath.com/2014/10/trondheim-in-norway-how-already.html#badsideroad" rel="nofollow">the same dangerous result</a>. In particular, the corner David Hembrowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14543024940730663645noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-56298656632959523352014-11-24T17:22:08.729+01:002014-11-24T17:22:08.729+01:00David,
This is not far from where I live and it h...David,<br /><br />This is not far from where I live and it has only been "live" for a few weeks at the very tail of the regular cycling season. It isn't a multiuse path in the absolute sense, but I think it's getting close from a practical point of view. What it is is a segregated cycle track that's flush to the adjacent sidewalk:<br /><br /><a href="http://Davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15857050473904460243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-18406626643274290752014-11-24T05:10:03.209+01:002014-11-24T05:10:03.209+01:00This is an outstanding article. All of the issues ...This is an outstanding article. All of the issues raised are the regular, if not the overwhelming subject of conversation when it comes to cycling where I live (in Princeton NJ). Bike facilities are almost non-existent, cyclists use the sidewalk, pedestrians complain, and people write letters to the paper about 'outlaw cyclists' and openly discuss the idea of somehow shaming them by an SFBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17397283983315237915noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3102538965694240940.post-24152678472162863072014-11-24T01:42:17.437+01:002014-11-24T01:42:17.437+01:00I couldn't even get all the way through your p...I couldn't even get all the way through your post without first piping up here. (I'll go back and finish, I promise)<br />The "hype" is the thing that I find the most nauseating. The city planners/officials/whatever like to pat themselves on the back and say they've done a good job, when in fact they've only presented yet another means by which pedestrians can get Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03523653271715366168noreply@blogger.com